How to get rid of the "Untitled Window" flashing by?

deepforest · 2025-05-10 13:09:18

Thanks ToZ for help smile

Some thing weird here.
I use Devuan Ceres (systemd free fork of Debian Sid)

Here dependence of actions:
nvidia-lecacy driver>>dracut>>initramfs>>display manager?

SOLVED seems
1. remove Slim display manager
2. install Lightdm display manager
3. no more Untitled Window at starting desktop

forcedtopicksomething · 2025-08-25 22:04:11

Well, I'm back after two years in "Plasma Hell". I feel kind of bad for comparing Xfce to Microsoft's attitude, but I was extremely frustrated (and remain so). Two years ago, I had to abandon using Xfce due to this bug as well as the taskbar constantly crashing and respawning itself. But Plasma turned out to be neverending pain as well, just in a different way. So I recently moved back to Xfce, hoping that these bugs would be gone now that I'm on Debian 13 instead of Debian 12, and with a completely new computer with completely different hardware (Intel GPU). Also, I've switched from xfce4-terminal to using xterm.

Well, it at first seemed like the bugs were gone, but then they started happening again, and now they're driving me insane. Just like before. It truly is maddening beyond words.

Having evaluated all alternatives, I truly feel as if there is nothing left to do at this point but to use Xfce. And yet it becomes impossible when I constantly see flashing stuff down there in the taskbar due to these two horribly elusive bugs.

I notice that there's been some activity in this thread since. I've also read and followed the same advice from earlier in the thread. I can't find out any new information. I today caught the flashing window with devilspie as:

Window Title: 'Untitled window'; Application Name: 'Untitled window'; Class: ''; Geometry: 1x1+0+0

And journalctl says (for the other, related problem with the taskbar crashing and respawning):

kernel: xfce4-panel[1582113]: segfault at 1dc0 ip 00007f924f19b45e sp 00007ffcebb64610 error 4 in libtasklist.so[b45e,7f924f197000+f000] likely on CPU 12 (core 24, socket 0)
systemd-coredump[1596911]: Process 1582113 (xfce4-panel) of user 1000 terminated abnormally with signal 11/SEGV, processing...
systemd-coredump[1596912]: Process 1582113 (xfce4-panel) of user 1000 dumped core.
#19 0x000055782806a3a4 n/a (/usr/bin/xfce4-panel + 0x133a4)
#22 0x000055782806a941 _start (/usr/bin/xfce4-panel + 0x13941)
drkonqi-coredump-processor[1596913]: "/usr/bin/xfce4-panel" 1582113 "/var/lib/systemd/coredump/core.xfce4-panel.1000.8b0c1de6dda6491a99570ec08c5fd955.1582113.1756157323000000.zst"
drkonqi-coredump-launcher[1596938]: Unable to find file for pid 1582113 expected at "kcrash-metadata/xfce4-panel.8b0c1de6dda6491a99570ec08c5fd955.1582113.ini"

I wish I could just learn what is causing this so I can work around it in my scripts. For all of Plasma's own serious issues, it has had zero issues in terms of the taskbar and flashing items for these two years on Plasma 5 and 6. It only happens with Xfce and I don't understand why. Everyone always says that Xfce is so stable and rock-solid. But at least we can rule out errors with my hardware and also with how I launch my scripts.

Any chance of this being resolved? Any "new leads", so to speak? I genuinely don't know what I'll do if this can't be resolved somehow. Probably I'll have to go live in a cave without any computer at all...

forcedtopicksomething · 2025-08-27 02:04:10

In desperation, I ended up taking your advice from earlier (~2 years) and made my scripts headless. I've ran it like that the entire day without encountering the crashing taskbar/tasklist or the flashing "Untitled Window" thing once. Then, when as a test I turned back on "non-headless" scripts, it immediately started happening again. So we can very safely conclude that the bug has *something* to do with spawning windows and/or changing their window title too often.

Even in spite of this, I like Xfce far better overall than Plasma. There are certainly some bizarre defaults and quirks, but after only a couple of days, I already feel much better using this.

Still, I now don't get my little "group" of non-headless scripts which has been a core part of my desktop ever since the Windows days (and these last two years of running Plasma). It would be so nice to have that. But I just can't "work around it" no matter what I try. And even if you were to discover the bug today, and fix it, I'd have to wait for another two years for Debian 14 to get an updated version of Xfce...

If you have any new ideas what could be the reason for the two weird glitches related to the taskbar/tasklist crashing and the "Untitled Window" flashing by, I'd love to hear them. That guy above seemed to think that it has to do with NVIDIA, but since I use an Intel GPU now, that cannot be it. I'm convinced that there is something that Xfce's taskbar/tasklist code doesn't like about me opening "too many" XTerms in a too short time, or changing the window title too often, or some combination of this. If I knew exactly what the issue is, I could maybe work around it somehow in my own code.

Last edited by forcedtopicksomething (2025-08-27 02:05:39)

ToZ · 2025-08-27 09:58:18

In desperation, I ended up taking your advice from earlier (~2 years) and made my scripts headless. I've ran it like that the entire day without encountering the crashing taskbar/tasklist or the flashing "Untitled Window" thing once.

Is there a reason you can't run your scripts headless then? Avoid the problem all together?

I'm convinced that there is something that Xfce's taskbar/tasklist code doesn't like about me opening "too many" XTerms in a too short time,

We're still in the same place as last time. If you want to get a developer to look at this, you should create a bug report.

forcedtopicksomething · 2025-08-27 21:21:03

ToZ wrote:

Is there a reason you can't run your scripts headless then? Avoid the problem all together?

Well, like I said, I am doing that now, but the reason I don't like to do so (and didn't in the first place, before wasting two years with Plasma) is that I don't get a neat little group that I can click on to see exactly what (non-headless) scripts in my "application" are currently running, and what they are doing. I've basically replicated it as a web interface, but obviously that is infinitely less useful as I have to load a webpage in my browser to check it instead of simply moving the cursor down to the group in the taskbar and click it once.

Basically, it feels crippling and it just doesn't make any sense. Why would something that works on several versions of Windows, Plasma, Trinity, MATE, etc. have issues on Xfce? (But those environments have other issues which prevent me from using them.)

ToZ wrote:

We're still in the same place as last time. If you want to get a developer to look at this, you should create a bug report.

Hopefully they are reading this forum? In fact, I thought you were the lead developer, but maybe I'm completely mistaken.

All yesterday and today (at least) I've been running my scripts headlessly without either of the two bugs happening. But then, suddenly, when I was just exiting fullscreen mode in XnView and then closed XnView, I noticed the taskbar flashed. And sure enough, it had crashed (according to journalctl) and immediately restarted itself, now with the items shuffled. And for some reason I can't move groups -- only single "bars". Is that really how it should be? It makes moving items around pretty meaningless since any group is immovable and doesn't let me move items to the right of it either (to "push" the group further left")...

Anyway, since I'm running my scripts headlessly, and it's not been acting up for so long, I assume it must have nothing to do with those and perhaps it's related to XnView? journalctl shows nothing for "xnview", though, but this for "panel":

Aug 27 22:36:35 Towery kernel: xfce4-panel[1836]: segfault at 200000001 ip 00007fe478a9c467 sp 00007ffd88da01a0 error 4 in libtasklist.so[b467,7fe478a98000+f000] likely on CPU 12 (core 24, socket 0)
Aug 27 22:36:35 Towery systemd-coredump[1628918]: Process 1836 (xfce4-panel) of user 1000 terminated abnormally with signal 11/SEGV, processing...
Aug 27 22:36:35 Towery systemd-coredump[1628919]: Process 1836 (xfce4-panel) of user 1000 dumped core.
                                                  #51 0x000055bddd63a3a4 n/a (/usr/bin/xfce4-panel + 0x133a4)
                                                  #54 0x000055bddd63a941 _start (/usr/bin/xfce4-panel + 0x13941)
Aug 27 22:36:35 Towery dbus-daemon[1643]: [session uid=1000 pid=1643 pidfd=5] Activating via systemd: service name='org.xfce.Xfconf' unit='xfconfd.service' requested by ':1.31124' (uid=1000 pid=1628961 comm="xfce4-panel --display :0.0 --sm-client-id 23a66d48")
Aug 27 22:36:35 Towery drkonqi-coredump-processor[1628920]: "/usr/bin/xfce4-panel" 1836 "/var/lib/systemd/coredump/core.xfce4-panel.1000.23ce99ed568e45bc873b1fbcc9c8a33c.1836.1756326995000000.zst"
Aug 27 22:36:35 Towery drkonqi-coredump-launcher[1628968]: Unable to find file for pid 1836 expected at "kcrash-metadata/xfce4-panel.23ce99ed568e45bc873b1fbcc9c8a33c.1836.ini"

What is it with specifically xfce4-panel and crashing?

ToZ · 2025-08-27 21:29:59

Hopefully they are reading this forum? In fact, I thought you were the lead developer, but maybe I'm completely mistaken.

Not necessarily - I only see one developer in here semi-regularly. I am not a core developer, I basically administer these forums.

What is it with specifically xfce4-panel and crashing?

My guess is that you are triggering a bug in the tasklist (window buttons) and that plugin is a direct part of xfce4-panel, so it crashes the panel. In a previous post I left instructions on how to get a backtrace - this will pinpoint the exact location in the code where the error is happening that could help a developer fix it.

Aug 27 22:36:35 Towery drkonqi-coredump-processor[1628920]: "/usr/bin/xfce4-panel" 1836 "/var/lib/systemd/coredump/core.xfce4-panel.1000.23ce99ed568e45bc873b1fbcc9c8a33c.1836.1756326995000000.zst"

I'm not too familiar with debian, but this might also work;

install the gdb package

run this command:

gdb /usr/bin/xfce4-panel /var/lib/systemd/coredump/core.xfce4-panel.1000.23ce99ed568e45bc873b1fbcc9c8a33c.1836.1756326995000000.zst

At the (gdb) prompt, run:
```
bt full
```
post back the output so we can see if it works

forcedtopicksomething · 2025-08-27 22:59:31

ToZ wrote:

[*]post back the output so we can see if it works[/*]

gdb /usr/bin/xfce4-panel /var/lib/systemd/coredump/core.xfce4-panel.1000.23ce99ed568e45bc873b1fbcc9c8a33c.1836.1756326995000000.zst
GNU gdb (Debian 16.3-1) 16.3
Copyright (C) 2024 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
License GPLv3+: GNU GPL version 3 or later <http://gnu.org/licenses/gpl.html>
This is free software: you are free to change and redistribute it.
There is NO WARRANTY, to the extent permitted by law.
Type "show copying" and "show warranty" for details.
This GDB was configured as "x86_64-linux-gnu".
Type "show configuration" for configuration details.
For bug reporting instructions, please see:
<https://www.gnu.org/software/gdb/bugs/>.
Find the GDB manual and other documentation resources online at:
    <http://www.gnu.org/software/gdb/documentation/>.
 
For help, type "help".
Type "apropos word" to search for commands related to "word"...
Reading symbols from /usr/bin/xfce4-panel...
(No debugging symbols found in /usr/bin/xfce4-panel)
"/var/lib/systemd/coredump/core.xfce4-panel.1000.23ce99ed568e45bc873b1fbcc9c8a33c.1836.1756326995000000.zst" is not a core dump: file format not recognized
(gdb)

I haven't touched that file. It exists, but apparently isn't valid? (I know nothing about gdb.)

Added later 16 min 24 s:
Worth mentioning: recently a person suggested the xfce4-docklike-plugin for me to try instead of the standard "Windows Buttons" (unsure what it's really called). Well, I've been trying it for a few hours now and it doesn't seem to be crashing the taskbar or causing "Untitled Window" flashes, even when I use non-headless scripts and allow them to update the window titles as much as they want! So far I haven't had a single crash.

But the main problems are:

1. This plugin only allows "icons" -- no "bars" which I prefer. I've carefully looked through all its settings. I like the way the default "Window Buttons" look much better.
2. It's an "external" (non-core) plugin -- it shouldn't be more stable than the "real thing", and it feels bad somehow to be using it. Not in a *practical* way, but more in a "trust" sense.
3. While I found out (by experimenting) that you can rearrange the icons with this plug-in, it requires holding down Ctrl while clicking and moving them. Still, better than the default menu in terms of actually allowing me to move grouped ones too, but I'm still not sure if that's actually how it's supposed to be working and not just another bug or some kind of misunderstanding by me.

It's interesting (assuming I just haven't been lucky so far and not triggered whatever condition causes the issues) if this plug-in actually works in a stable manner whereas the "core" stuff doesn't. Usually it's very much the other way around. Is the default "Window Buttons" thing maintained or maybe long-since dead?

Added later 3 h 48 min 19 s:
FFS... Scratch that about the xfce4-docklike-plugin not crashing. The damn thing crashes as well, seemingly for no reason:

	drkonqi-coredump-processor[2504660]: "/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/xfce4/panel/wrapper-2.0" 2408269 "/var/lib/systemd/coredump/core.wrapper-2\\x2e0.1000.23ce99ed568e45bc873b1fbcc9c8a33c.2408269.1756348701000000.zst"

What is going on? Am I not allowed to use any desktop environment without serious bugs which make it impossible to use them? But it seems (I'm not sure) as if this one at least keeps the items in the right order instead of shuffling them around each time it crashes. I guess if this continues (which it more than likely will) I'll have to make them headless again. Sigh...

Added later 4 h 06 min:
... it also shuffles the items when it crashes.

I'm completely defeated at this point. I genuinely don't know what I'm going to do. Except sleep for now.

forcedtopicksomething · 2025-08-29 22:47:21

If you don't mind, I'll try to catch the core dumps for some time and try to find any pattern, and then create a new thread which is better summarized and with my findings. The command `coredumpctl gdb` has proven very useful.

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#51 2025-05-10 13:09:18

Re: How to get rid of the "Untitled Window" flashing by?

#52 2025-08-25 22:04:11

Re: How to get rid of the "Untitled Window" flashing by?

#53 2025-08-27 02:04:10

Re: How to get rid of the "Untitled Window" flashing by?

#54 2025-08-27 09:58:18

Re: How to get rid of the "Untitled Window" flashing by?

#55 2025-08-27 21:21:03

Re: How to get rid of the "Untitled Window" flashing by?

#56 2025-08-27 21:29:59

Re: How to get rid of the "Untitled Window" flashing by?

#57 2025-08-27 22:59:31

Re: How to get rid of the "Untitled Window" flashing by?

#58 2025-08-29 22:47:21

Re: How to get rid of the "Untitled Window" flashing by?

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