Theming Woes

PseudAnonymous · 2021-12-08 18:24:25

Okay, so, I'm not of a mind to brutalise myself right now and my former theme is just a bit too brutalist for my current frame of mind — I want something, I dunno ... else.

I played around with Themix /Oomox again for a bit, but just wasn't getting the result wanted — I'm a music person, not a graphic designer.

So, I went trawling and a few things caught my eye — in particular the Suru Plus Aspromauros Carboniferous-Gold icon pack

Consequently, I set about designing (as best I could) a desktop theme that would suit them. And I think I haven't done too badly, all things considered (i.e. that I'm not a graphic designer and actually pretty bad at this kind of thing). I am, in fact, for once in my life, quite pleased with my handiwork ...

But, I've hit a couple of snags.

First of all, there doesn't seem to be a way in Themix /Oomox to differentiate between the highlight when it's on something active and when it's inactive ... which leads to less than desirable results: in the above image, the highlight on the xfdesktop windowlist is perfect, but on an inactive item (i.e. on another workspace), it doesn't look quite so good ...

Nor does it work in other situations; see the below image, in which I've picked out three examples — note the one on the right, which shows how clicking in the box brings up a perfectly functional menu (the fourth element in the list is, once again, highlighted exactly as I want things to be), but the default option is invisible otherwise, because it's the same colour as the button background until the button is clicked (see the other two).

Clearly, I need a more sophisticated tool than Themix /Oomox (which?) ... or someone knowledgeable to tell me what I need to do in the CSS to resolve this.

Secondly, and rather bafflingly, there are some weird impacts upon apps and windows.

My former theme, based on the DarkOnesk16 theme, was made a few years ago now. It still works perfectly well and I'd simply edit it, but I can't see how to import it into Themix /Oomox. So, I stared out from scratch with the DarkOnesk3 theme. It all went well until the time came to export it with the Materia style for UI elements. My machine just wasn't having it — the system went into overload and eventually hung completely. I tried a couple more times, but the third time, I kept a close eye on the system and watched it use all my CPU, all 4GB RAM and when it reached the limit of my swap (8GB) I had to bail out before it locked up again (and even then it was touch and go as to whether I'd be able to shutdown cleanly).

So, I gave up on that idea and stuck with exporting the Oomox style — not quite as appealing as the Materia one, but close enough..

All went well

Until, I hit the snag of the inactive highlight.

I launched GIMP and had a play a round wit different colour values, seeing if anything caught my eye. Which was when, for various reasons (mostly, different web browsers theming themselves in different ways), I had a need to export a solid colour png. Try as I might, when the time came to export the image, I couldn't resize the dialogue box to get to the 'OK' button. Furthermore, when I tried maximising the GIMP window, in the hope that would resolve the matter, I found I couldn't do that either!

I don't have this problem with the former theme. In fact, I don't even need to resize the dialogue box in the first place — it fits more than comfortably within the confines of my display resolution.

Struck by this, I tried out various themes, including the default Adwaita theme. No problem there either.

Investigation showed I exported the former theme with both GTK2 and GTK3/XFWM options. I don't think the current Adwaita is GTK2, but I don't know enough about these things to know for sure (which is why I was using Themix /Oomox. to begin with), so I'm at a bit of a loss to explain it..

Additionally, whilst the previous export of the DarkOnesk16 UI style will chnage the background of my root filemanger (SpaceFM), the current one will not.

What am I not grasping about this situation?

What can do to resolve it? Can it be resolved?

Thanks.

Last edited by PseudAnonymous (2021-12-08 18:45:35)

ToZ · 2021-12-10 16:26:00

PseudAnonymous wrote:

Consequently, I set about designing (as best I could) a desktop theme that would suit them. And I think I haven't done too badly, all things considered (i.e. that I'm not a graphic designer and actually pretty bad at this kind of thing). I am, in fact, for once in my life, quite pleased with my handiwork ...

Are you able to share a copy of this theme?

Until, I hit the snag of the inactive highlight.

I've been looking at this and it is indeed strange - which is why I want to see the theme you are using. I think it might be related to the default "insensitive fg" values, but I can't get them to change in my tests.

I don't think the current Adwaita is GTK2, but I don't know enough about these things to know for sure (which is why I was using Themix /Oomox. to begin with), so I'm at a bit of a loss to explain it..

Adwaita is the default GTK3 theme and does not cotain a GTK2 component or theme configurations. The default GTK2 theme is Raleigh.

Additionally, whilst the previous export of the DarkOnesk16 UI style will chnage the background of my root filemanger (SpaceFM), the current one will not.

Is SpaceFM built against GTK2 or GTK3 libraries?

PseudAnonymous · 2021-12-12 16:19:24

ToZ wrote:

Are you able to share a copy of this theme?

Very likely — what do you need?

ToZ wrote:

I've been looking at this and it is indeed strange - which is why I want to see the theme you are using. I think it might be related to the default "insensitive fg" values, but I can't get them to change in my tests.

In an ideal world, the normal view would be gold on a transparent background and the highlight would be bold gold on a transparent background, with a momentary flash to draw attention, but I'd settle for both active and inactive items simply being legible.

ToZ wrote:

Adwaita is the default GTK3 theme and does not cotain a GTK2 component or theme configurations. The default GTK2 theme is Raleigh.

Don't have Raleigh installed — went for a (ha) minimalist install this time (20GB's worth of apps and dependencies to cover all possible eventualities, but no more of anything than necessary to achieve that), so, I figured Adwaita would suffice as a default theme and I'd just add my own. Do you need me to add it?

ToZ wrote:

Is SpaceFM built against GTK2 or GTK3 libraries?

Ummmm ... apparently, the rabbit is the only mammal that cannot vomit.

tl;dr: no idea ... gimme a sec, I'll look

[...]

Much to my surprise (given when it was last updated), both

For what it's worth, there's also a GitHub page

And it's available to the likes of you and me from the AUR.

Last edited by PseudAnonymous (2021-12-12 16:44:05)

ToZ · 2021-12-12 17:13:42

PseudAnonymous wrote:

ToZ wrote:
Are you able to share a copy of this theme?
Very likely — what do you need?

All of the theme files. I'd like to install them in a vm here and see if I can change that value.

ToZ wrote:
Adwaita is the default GTK3 theme and does not cotain a GTK2 component or theme configurations. The default GTK2 theme is Raleigh.
Don't have Raleigh installed — went for a (ha) minimalist install this time (20GB's worth of apps and dependencies to cover all possible eventualities, but no more of anything than necessary to achieve that), so, I figured Adwaita would suffice as a default theme and I'd just add my own. Do you need me to add it?

Neither Adwaita nor Raleigh need to be installed. They are baked into GTK3 and GTK2 respectively. If GTK can not find a theme, or if one is not specified, it uses these as the defaults. So basically, if your system doesn't specify a GTK3 theme, it uses Adwaita. If it doesn't specify a GTK2 theme, it uses Raleigh.

ToZ wrote:
Is SpaceFM built against GTK2 or GTK3 libraries?
Ummmm ... apparently, the rabbit is the only mammal that cannot vomit.
tl;dr: no idea ... gimme a sec, I'll look
[...]
Much to my surprise (given when it was last updated), both
For what it's worth, there's also a GitHub page
And it's available to the likes of you and me from the AUR.

It's GTK3-based so it should respond to the GTK3 css directives.

PseudAnonymous · 2021-12-12 18:18:47

ToZ wrote:

All of the theme files. I'd like to install them in a vm here and see if I can change that value.

Theme here

Icons here

ToZ wrote:

Neither Adwaita nor Raleigh need to be installed. They are baked into GTK3 and GTK2 respectively. If GTK can not find a theme, or if one is not specified, it uses these as the defaults. So basically, if your system doesn't specify a GTK3 theme, it uses Adwaita. If it doesn't specify a GTK2 theme, it uses Raleigh.

Well, only Adwaita and High Contrast appear in the Appearance dialogue.

ToZ wrote:

It's GTK3-based so it should respond to the GTK3 css directives.

As said, it does to the old theme, but that appears to have GTK2 elements as well as GTK3

The non-root SpaceFM responds to the new theme, however (as can be seen in the first desktop image).

Last edited by PseudAnonymous (2021-12-12 18:27:14)

ToZ · 2021-12-12 21:53:31

Spent some time looking at your theme and I cannot figure out how to changed in color of the "disabled" elements in the window when hovered over.

You can change the color of all disabled text items with:

*:disabled {  color: #987242 }

But I can't change the color when a disabled item is hovered over - I don't think gtk supports it.

PseudAnonymous · 2021-12-13 16:07:01

ToZ wrote:

Spent some time looking at your theme and I cannot figure out how to changed in color of the "disabled" elements in the window when hovered over.

Ho hum. Thanks for looking into it.

ToZ wrote:

You can change the color of all disabled text items with:
*:disabled {  color: #987242 }

You'll have to forgive my ignorance, but I'm really not up on the intricacies of theming.

I looked in the [...]/gtk-3.20/dist/gtk.css, but all I found were entries like

*:disabled, *:disabled:disabled {
    color: mix(#8a6940,#242822,0.5); }

Not

*:disabled {  color: #987242 }

Where should I be looking?

ToZ wrote:

But I can't change the color when a disabled item is hovered over - I don't think gtk supports it.

I don't suppose you have any influence over the devs (he said wistfully).

ToZ · 2021-12-13 21:17:39

PseudAnonymous wrote:

ToZ wrote:
You can change the color of all disabled text items with:
*:disabled {  color: #987242 }
You'll have to forgive my ignorance, but I'm really not up on the intricacies of theming.
I looked in the [...]/gtk-3.20/dist/gtk.css, but all I found were entries like
*:disabled, *:disabled:disabled {
    color: mix(#8a6940,#242822,0.5); }
Not
*:disabled {  color: #987242 }
Where should I be looking?

You can change those existing values, or add them into ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css as overrides.

ToZ wrote:
But I can't change the color when a disabled item is hovered over - I don't think gtk supports it.
I don't suppose you have any influence over the devs (he said wistfully).

With GTK devs? I don't think anyone does. The change would need to happen in gtk itself.

PseudAnonymous · 2021-12-14 16:37:28

ToZ wrote:

You can change those existing values, or add them into ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css as overrides.

Would it be simpler to edit this instead?

ToZ wrote:

With GTK devs? I don't think anyone does. The change would need to happen in gtk itself.

But you're a respected memner of the XFCE community.

And it's not like XFCE is some minority WM fetish group like, say ... oh, I don't know ... Fluxbox? ... surely they'd listen to you.

What if you were to offer to help out in some way with ... you know ... 'favours' (as it were)?

Last edited by PseudAnonymous (2021-12-14 16:41:32)

ToZ · 2021-12-14 18:46:19

PseudAnonymous wrote:

ToZ wrote:
You can change those existing values, or add them into ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css as overrides.
Would it be simpler to edit this instead?

Yes, you can edit the theme files directly.

PseudAnonymous · 2021-12-15 16:20:22

You know, I'm beginning to wonder if there's some other factor involved in this.

I booted to the old build, exported shiki-noble-dark from Themix (Oomox style), applied it in the Appearance dialogue and everything was good (thus ruling out some setting, or resources, specific to the old speer-STEE2 theme).

I rebooted to the new build, did the same and, once again, GIMP will not resize.

If I change to an exported Darkonesk16, GIMP responds to the XFCE Window Manager Maximise Window toggle and, so long as I don't close it before applying my new theme again, it will do so after the change back. But it doesn't re-scale the way my old theme makes it, nor does the responsiveness last beyond the session.

NEW THEME

speer-STEE2 THEME

The old (Arch) build is pretty much as up-to-date as the new one (maybe two-to-three weeks behind, but no more) and I doubt anything radical has changed in the interim, so I can't think what it might be.

As far as I can see, my desktop and dispaly settings are identical, so where else should I be looking?

The fact that the speer-STEE2 theme works on both builds seems to imply that it's not some setting unique to the old build (nor to GIMP itself).

Any ideas?

Last edited by PseudAnonymous (2021-12-15 16:37:03)

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#1 2021-12-08 18:24:25

Theming Woes

#2 2021-12-10 16:26:00

Re: Theming Woes

#3 2021-12-12 16:19:24

Re: Theming Woes

#4 2021-12-12 17:13:42

Re: Theming Woes

#5 2021-12-12 18:18:47

Re: Theming Woes

#6 2021-12-12 21:53:31

Re: Theming Woes

#7 2021-12-13 16:07:01

Re: Theming Woes

#8 2021-12-13 21:17:39

Re: Theming Woes

#9 2021-12-14 16:37:28

Re: Theming Woes

#10 2021-12-14 18:46:19

Re: Theming Woes

#11 2021-12-15 16:20:22

Re: Theming Woes

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