new windows always show up in current workspace

peterdb · 2022-01-18 12:52:26

Hi, relatively new user of xfce4, so please forgive me if I ask something obvious or so.

I have a couple of workspaces. I have applications that might run for hours and then show a new window with some results. What happens is that such new windows always show up in the current workspace. What I would like to have is that new windows show up in the workspace where the application that creates them is running.

I have looked in the xfwm4 settings but I could not find anything that seems to be applicable.

Is it possible what I want, and how?

ToZ · 2022-01-18 13:29:53

Hello and welcome.

The setting you are looking for is located at Settings Manager > Window Manager Tweaks > Focus > "When a window raises itself". You'll want to probably set that to "Do nothing".

peterdb · 2022-01-18 14:51:04

Tried it, but did not work...

ToZ · 2022-01-18 17:41:54

Which application(s) are doing this?

Also what version of xfwm4 are you using and is it running?

xfwm4 -V
ps -ef | grep xfwm4

Skaperen · 2022-01-18 19:38:20

workspaces are not real. they are a hack. the windows known to be in the "current" workspace are shown and all other windows are minimized. when you switch to a different workspace the display manager minimizes all the windows "in" the workspace you are leaving and maximizes the windows "in" the workspace you are going to. X never had workspaces as a real place windows could be in. this hack has been around for years, even before Xfce. what Xfce has done is carry out the same hack in a cleaner and smoother way.

it would be nice to add on a way for a new window to start in a minimized way and tell the window manage which workspace to remember it as being "in", my initialization code that starts certain windows in certain workspaces has to do it by switching workspace. it then has to wait for the window to actually appear before switching, again. that slows down my big setup.

what i do to separate a lot of things is to launch multiple users through lightdm. they way i do it is physically insecure. i turn off the need for password login on the console and use dm-tool switch-to-user $user to make the changes. each user runs in its own instance of X. for security i have added encrypted storage. when i leave for a while, i shutdown my laptop. not much to do if someone else boots it up. maybe Wayland will have a more flexible API that can do this more securely. remote logins are still secure because SSHD still works the way it always has (no changes to do this). users still have passwords and/or ssh keys but lightdm is not using them to create a new login or to switch loins.

i use keyboard shortcuts to switch users and switch workspaces. i currently have 19 usernames active, each with 10 workspaces. Xfce forums is in user "forums" workspace 8.

Last edited by Skaperen (2022-01-18 19:49:46)

peterdb · 2022-01-19 06:22:40

ToZ wrote:

Which application(s) are doing this?
Also what version of xfwm4 are you using and is it running?
xfwm4 -V
ps -ef | grep xfwm4

miaccess9 ~ xfwm4 -V
	This is xfwm4 version 4.12.3 (revision 7fdcb53) for Xfce 4.12
	Released under the terms of the GNU General Public License.
	Compiled against GTK+-2.24.28, using GTK+-2.24.31.

	Build configuration and supported features:
	- Startup notification support:                 Yes
	- XSync support:                                Yes
	- Render support:                               Yes
	- Xrandr support:                               Yes
	- Embedded compositor:                          Yes
	- KDE systray proxy (deprecated):               No
miaccess9 ~ ps -ef | grep xfmw4
pdeboer   1250  1082  0 07:19 pts/28   00:00:00 grep --color=auto xfmw4

peterdb · 2022-01-19 06:26:57

Skaperen wrote:

workspaces are not real. they are a hack.
......

From this I conclude that what I want is not possible sad .

ToZ · 2022-01-19 11:22:38

peterdb wrote:

Skaperen wrote:
workspaces are not real. they are a hack.
......
From this I conclude that what I want is not possible .

But they still function like workspaces for all intents and purposes.

@peterdb, you are not running xfwm4. What are using in its place? compiz? mutter?

You can start xfwm4 via:

xfwm4 --replace

...and then test to see if the setting from above works.

peterdb · 2022-01-19 14:21:52

Under the Settings Editor (Customized settings stored by Xfconf), there are a bunch of xfce4-* channels, and one called xfwm4. That is why I thought xfwm4 is running.

How do I see what is running instead?

peterdb · 2022-01-19 14:24:03

miaccess9 ~ xfwm4 --replace
Waiting for current window manager (Xfwm4) on screen miaccess9:9.0 to exit: Done

(xfwm4:23310): xfwm4-WARNING **: 15:22:30.903: Error opening /dev/dri/card0: Permission denied

(xfwm4:23310): xfwm4-WARNING **: 15:22:30.973: Failed to connect to session manager: Failed to connect to the session manager: SESSION_MANAGER environment variable not defined

ToZ · 2022-01-19 15:17:15

Which distro are you using?

Waiting for current window manager (Xfwm4) on screen miaccess9:9.0 to exit: Done

What kind of system is this?

KBar · 2022-01-19 15:20:57

Open the Settings Editor app, select the xfce4-session channel and look for the Client0_Command property under /sessions/Failsafe. Client0 is usually the window manager to be launched by default at session startup. What do you have in there?

peterdb · 2022-01-19 15:43:54

ToZ wrote:

Which distro are you using?
Waiting for current window manager (Xfwm4) on screen miaccess9:9.0 to exit: Done
What kind of system is this?

miaccess9 ~ lsb_release -a
LSB Version:	:core-4.1-amd64:core-4.1-noarch:cxx-4.1-amd64:cxx-4.1-noarch:desktop-4.1-amd64:desktop-4.1-noarch:languages-4.1-amd64:languages-4.1-noarch:printing-4.1-amd64:printing-4.1-noarch
Distributor ID:	RedHatEnterpriseServer
Description:	Red Hat Enterprise Linux Server release 7.9 (Maipo)
Release:	7.9
Codename:	Maipo

This runs in an opentext Exceed Turbox Client.

peterdb · 2022-01-19 15:45:18

KBar wrote:

Open the Settings Editor app, select the xfce4-session channel and look for the Client0_Command property under /sessions/Failsafe. Client0 is usually the window manager to be launched by default at session startup. What do you have in there?

Type: Array
Value: ["xfwm4"]

ToZ · 2022-01-19 16:02:22

miaccess9 ~ ps -ef | grep xfmw4
pdeboer 1250 1082 0 07:19 pts/28 00:00:00 grep --color=auto xfmw4

I see - you misspelled xfwm4 and I didn't catch it the first time.

Is it a specific application that does this? Maybe the application is coded such that it brings up a window at the current mouse location?

peterdb · 2022-01-19 16:23:35

Sorry for the confusion by misspelling!

Any application seems to do this.

ToZ · 2022-01-19 17:33:33

Does your system log X client messages to an ~/.xsession-errors file? If so, can you post back the contents of that file? If not, search the other log files for xfwm4 entries - thats the file to review.

Can you also post back:

xfconf-query -c xfwm4 -lv

KBar · 2022-01-19 18:00:11

Window Buttons have an option to Restore minimized windows to current workspace. Try unchecking that.

Skaperen · 2022-01-20 00:05:17

peterdb wrote:

Skaperen wrote:
workspaces are not real. they are a hack.
......
From this I conclude that what I want is not possible .

no, it is possible. it would need to be done through the manager process that manages the workspaces. the window would need to be launched minimized to begin with. then, the manager process would be told which workspace it goes in. then that manager would add it to the list it keeps. if it does belong in the current workspace it would be maximized just like a switch to this workspace.

not impossible, just more complicated than expected.

peterdb · 2022-01-20 06:57:53

ToZ wrote:

Does your system log X client messages to an ~/.xsession-errors file? If so, can you post back the contents of that file? If not, search the other log files for xfwm4 entries - thats the file to review.
Can you also post back:
xfconf-query -c xfwm4 -lv

There is no ~/.xsession-errors file.
The only relevant file I see is a ~/.xfce4-session.verbose-log file. It has just one xfwm4 entry though:

TRACE[xfsm-properties.c:489] xfsm_properties_set_string(): -> Set string (Program, xfwm4)

miaccess7 ~ xfconf-query -c xfwm4 -lv
/general/activate_action                 none
/general/borderless_maximize             true
/general/box_move                        false
/general/box_resize                      false
/general/button_layout                   O|SHMC
/general/button_offset                   0
/general/button_spacing                  0
/general/click_to_focus                  true
/general/cycle_apps_only                 false
/general/cycle_draw_frame                true
/general/cycle_hidden                    true
/general/cycle_minimum                   true
/general/cycle_preview                   true
/general/cycle_tabwin_mode               0
/general/cycle_workspaces                false
/general/double_click_action             maximize
/general/double_click_distance           5
/general/double_click_time               250
/general/easy_click                      Alt
/general/focus_delay                     250
/general/focus_hint                      true
/general/focus_new                       true
/general/frame_opacity                   100
/general/full_width_title                true
/general/horiz_scroll_opacity            false
/general/inactive_opacity                90
/general/maximized_offset                0
/general/mousewheel_rollup               true
/general/move_opacity                    100
/general/placement_mode                  center
/general/placement_ratio                 20
/general/popup_opacity                   100
/general/prevent_focus_stealing          false
/general/raise_delay                     250
/general/raise_on_click                  true
/general/raise_on_focus                  false
/general/raise_with_any_button           true
/general/repeat_urgent_blink             false
/general/resize_opacity                  100
/general/scroll_workspaces               true
/general/shadow_delta_height             0
/general/shadow_delta_width              0
/general/shadow_delta_x                  0
/general/shadow_delta_y                  -3
/general/shadow_opacity                  50
/general/show_app_icon                   false
/general/show_dock_shadow                true
/general/show_frame_shadow               true
/general/show_popup_shadow               false
/general/snap_resist                     false
/general/snap_to_border                  true
/general/snap_to_windows                 false
/general/snap_width                      10
/general/sync_to_vblank                  false
/general/theme                           Default
/general/tile_on_move                    true
/general/title_alignment                 center
/general/title_font                      Sans Bold 9
/general/title_horizontal_offset         0
/general/titleless_maximize              false
/general/title_shadow_active             false
/general/title_shadow_inactive           false
/general/title_vertical_offset_active    0
/general/title_vertical_offset_inactive  0
/general/toggle_workspaces               false
/general/unredirect_overlays             true
/general/urgent_blink                    false
/general/use_compositing                 true
/general/workspace_count                 4
/general/workspace_names                 <<UNSUPPORTED>>
/general/wrap_cycle                      true
/general/wrap_layout                     true
/general/wrap_resistance                 10
/general/wrap_windows                    true
/general/wrap_workspaces                 false
/general/zoom_desktop                    true

peterdb · 2022-01-20 07:09:18

KBar wrote:

Window Buttons have an option to Restore minimized windows to current workspace. Try unchecking that.

It is already unchecked.

ToZ · 2022-01-20 12:00:37

peterdb wrote:

There is no ~/.xsession-errors file.
The only relevant file I see is a ~/.xfce4-session.verbose-log file. It has just one xfwm4 entry though:
TRACE[xfsm-properties.c:489] xfsm_properties_set_string(): -> Set string (Program, xfwm4)

Unfortunately this isn't it. It must get logged somewhere. What does the following return?

sudo fgrep -ri xfwm4 /var/log/*

peterdb · 2022-01-20 12:17:45

Unfortunately, I am not in the sudoers file yet (working in company) . Will see if I can be added.

ToZ · 2022-01-20 21:49:29

Are you able to provide a reproducer? Document steps that we can follow to test on our system. Preferably using non-specialized apps (something we would have installed or is easy to install).

peterdb · 2022-01-21 06:56:27

Ok, let's do a simple one. If I enter

sleep 5; xterm &

and immediately go to a different workspace, then the xterm pops up in the workspace where I am. I would like it to pop up in the workspace where I entered the command.

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#1 2022-01-18 12:52:26

new windows always show up in current workspace

#2 2022-01-18 13:29:53

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#3 2022-01-18 14:51:04

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#4 2022-01-18 17:41:54

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#5 2022-01-18 19:38:20

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#6 2022-01-19 06:22:40

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#7 2022-01-19 06:26:57

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#8 2022-01-19 11:22:38

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#9 2022-01-19 14:21:52

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#10 2022-01-19 14:24:03

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#11 2022-01-19 15:17:15

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#12 2022-01-19 15:20:57

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#13 2022-01-19 15:43:54

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#14 2022-01-19 15:45:18

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#15 2022-01-19 16:02:22

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#16 2022-01-19 16:23:35

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#17 2022-01-19 17:33:33

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#18 2022-01-19 18:00:11

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#19 2022-01-20 00:05:17

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#20 2022-01-20 06:57:53

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#21 2022-01-20 07:09:18

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#22 2022-01-20 12:00:37

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#23 2022-01-20 12:17:45

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#24 2022-01-20 21:49:29

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

#25 2022-01-21 06:56:27

Re: new windows always show up in current workspace

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